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Opening post


eugene wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 12:01 am

Of course I have a problem with women being killed, but much of what goes on in the world is outside the purview of the ICC. Afghanistan are in direct violation of ICC membership requirements. If Afghanistan shouldn't be banned for gender discrimination why were South Africa ever banned for racial discrimination?


Afghanistan's stance on women's cricket is currently under investigation by the ICC.
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Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2024 2:26 pm

If democratic countries are allowed to starve and then bomb women to shreds then why stop at simply not allowing them to play cricket? Besides Afghanistan are in on merit. The quality of cricket they've played is remarkable. Almost made it to the ODI semis and now in the T20 semis and have beaten Pakistan, England, Australia, and NZ along the way.


This is a bullshit argument. You are basically saying that because of the geo-political issues that exist that result in the war in Afghanistan, it is ok for the Afghanistan team to abuse women. That is absolutely bullshit. There is no justification. Just because one does one thing, does not allow for the other to happen. The issues here is not the geo-political issues, but rather the blatant abuse and disregard for the ICC terms of being a full member, and that Afghanistan are allowed to get away with it. It is almost akin to doping because they are being treated differently to all the other members. Zim have been banned for less. Sri Lanka have been banned for less. South Africa have been banned. So what makes Afghanistan different to all these other nations. It's simply about their terms of being a full ICC member, and if they are upholding that.


Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2024 6:24 pm

b) If that money from a) above was instead given to the men, would it really make a difference to how the Zimbabwe men's team perform? Would it really turn Marumani or Madhevere into 30 average batsmen? Would it have pushed Zimbabwe past the line against Uganda, Scotland, or UAE?


More funding does make a difference. It means they can afford a higher calibre coach. They can buy a better level of equipment. Ultimately is does come down to the players, but the small things can allow those players to improve. It also means they can afford to host more series, more matches etc.

The simple fact is that Afghanistan agreed to certain rules when they became a full member. They are breaking those rules and there are no repercussions for them. Simple as that. It's unfair to the other teams.


Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 12:13 am

Afghanistan's stance on women's cricket is currently under investigation by the ICC.


This is virtue signalling from the iCC. They are too scared to lose their darling Rashid Khan, so they are pretending to do something. They should not be allowed to play until the investigation is over. Everyone knows what is happening, they don't need to pretend to investigate anything.
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What exactly needs to be investigated? Not exactly much mystery as to what has happened to the women's team. My argument against Afghanistan is very deliberately avoiding the much more complex world of geo-politics, but is instead focused very narrowly on the ICC's own rules. There is clear government interference with the running of the ACB, and that interference is leading to a key aspect of full membership not being fulfilled. I'm not sure how anyone can argue against a ban at this point.
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zimbos_05 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 12:15 am

This is a bullshit argument. You are basically saying that because of the geo-political issues that exist that result in the war in Afghanistan, it is ok for the Afghanistan team to abuse women.


I didn't say that.

I asked that if white countries can slaughter thousands of civilians and be accepted in international fora, then why can't brown ones ban women's sports and also be accepted in international sporting fora? I didn't say what Afghanistan is doing is OK or that I support it.


This is virtue signalling from the iCC. They are too scared to lose their darling Rashid Khan, so they are pretending to do something. They should not be allowed to play until the investigation is over. Everyone knows what is happening, they don't need to pretend to investigate anything.


This opens a can of worms. Do we then also suspend the USA because they are banning gynecological healthcare to women? A woman can survive without a cricket bat, but not a ruptured fallopian tube.
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eugene wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 1:19 am

What exactly needs to be investigated?


All allegations have to be investigated in order for due process to be fulfilled.
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Kriterion, I don't know why you are having so much trouble understanding this. Cricket USA isn't mandated by the ICC to provide gynecological care to women, it is however mandated to have a women's cricket team if it wants to be a full member. Afghanistan is in direct violation of ICC requirements for full membership.
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eugene wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 3:03 am

Kriterion, I don't know why you are having so much trouble understanding this. Cricket USA isn't mandated by the ICC to provide gynecological care to women, it is however mandated to have a women's cricket team if it wants to be a full member. Afghanistan is in direct violation of ICC requirements for full membership.


I may be wrong, but I think an exception for cultural reasons had been made for Afghanistan when they were promoted in 2017.
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Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 2:43 am

I didn't say that.

I asked that if white countries can slaughter thousands of civilians and be accepted in international fora, then why can't brown ones ban women's sports and also be accepted in international sporting fora? I didn't say what Afghanistan is doing is OK or that I support it.


Do you hear yourself? You may not be saying it directly, but it is definitely implied that one wrong makes another wrong ok. It's a stupid argument.


Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 2:43 am

This opens a can of worms. Do we then also suspend the USA because they are banning gynecological healthcare to women? A woman can survive without a cricket bat, but not a ruptured fallopian tube.


Seriously dude, wtf? The ICC has no jurisdiction over US healthcare. They have jurisdiction over who is and who isn't a test playing nation. Afghanistan is a test playing and part of being one is having a womens team. They are breaking that rule, plain and simple. There is no can of worms to be opened.

Holy s**t dude. You are are out here actively trying to advocate for the mistreatment of women.
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Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 12:13 am


eugene wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 12:01 am

Of course I have a problem with women being killed, but much of what goes on in the world is outside the purview of the ICC. Afghanistan are in direct violation of ICC membership requirements. If Afghanistan shouldn't be banned for gender discrimination why were South Africa ever banned for racial discrimination?


Afghanistan's stance on women's cricket is currently under investigation by the ICC.


May I point out that the 'panel' that are 'investigating' it is, of course, an all-male panel?

Also as we know the ICC is so corrupt that it wouldn't look out of place if it was headquartered in Zimbabwe.
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While we are on the subject may I post your regular reminder that Ireland are also in breach of the ICC full membership rules and have been since 2020? A full member criteria is that a domestic first class structure is payed. Ireland has not payed domestic first class cricket since August 2019.

Admittedly not playing a few games of cricket is not as bad as systematic human rights abuses and mistreatment of women, but still - both of the 'new' full members breach the rules they signed up to, to zero consequence. The ICC is toothless.

If it was Zimbabwe doing either of these things we'd be suspended quicker than you can say SRC.
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Ireland are ridiculous as a full member, they seemingly have little intention of playing test cricket and their website mentions nothing of a first class competition past or future. To think Zimbabwe missed out on a World Cup for much much less.
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I'm a practising muslim and I really couldn't care less for Afghanistan. They are clearly in breach of ICC rules and should not be a full member nation. They also come across as an arrogant bunch of players and now as we've seen with Naib, shamelessly immoral.

Nothing would please me more than South Africa beating them tomorrow.
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For the record, I'd like to see Afghanistan lose to South Africa as well. Because I'm a salty ass Bangladesh fan and they beat my team. 😂

I'm just not going to fake caring about women's rights in Afghanistan but not complain about women not having healthcare access or being massacred elsewhere.
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Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 3:17 pm

For the record, I'd like to see Afghanistan lose to South Africa as well. Because I'm a salty ass Bangladesh fan and they beat my team. 😂

I'm just not going to fake caring about women's rights in Afghanistan but not complain about women not having healthcare access or being massacred elsewhere.


There are a lot of wrong things going on in the World Kriterion, it is not the ICC's job to take care of all that. It is a simple rule that every full member nation must have a women's team and they don't, so they should not be a full member nation.

I have no problem in Afghanistan being an associate nation, absolutely fine with that.
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sam_ahm wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 4:07 pm

There are a lot of wrong things going on in the World Kriterion, it is not the ICC's job to take care of all that. It is a simple rule that every full member nation must have a women's team and they don't, so they should not be a full member nation.

I have no problem in Afghanistan being an associate nation, absolutely fine with that.


Yes but now imagine whitewashing Afghanistan's abuses simply because they are open society for all male Muslims with 6 inch beards or longer and the only vibrant Islamic Emirate in the region.
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sam_ahm wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 4:07 pm

I have no problem in Afghanistan being an associate nation, absolutely fine with that.


The Afghans and the Irish hardly play Test cricket anyways. So they are de facto Associate nations, like Zimbabwe. So technically they can argue they don't need to be held to the same standard as the 9 WTC teams because they are not in the same category, they don't get the same opportunities, and they don't get the same funding.

I think all this crying about Afghanistan and Ireland is a bad look. Its just a dumb as complaining about Rashid Khan's age. How many 40 year olds do you know that can take 4 wickets and smack 19 off 10 to win their side a virtual Quarterfinal at the World Cup?

I've been on the Bangladesh forums on social media and all the BD fans are criticizing the Bangladesh team for their cowardice and all praise for Afghanistan for bossing us. These guys don't even have a home ground for internationals. Many of them grew up in tents as refugees and endured a lot more hardship than the middle class Bangladesh players who've had easy lives since they were born. And yet they've battled and prevailed.

The only blemish on their win was Gulbadin's faking an hamstring injury...but even Rashid Khan was livid about that and was yelling at Gulbadin to cut that s**t off. Gulbadin should be fined his entire match fee and even suspended from a few games. But it wasn't that big a deal as Liton Das was joking with Mohammad Nabi about it. You can argue that Liton should have been a bit more upset because Bangladesh were just one boundary away from a DL win at that stage...although that would have only pushed Australia through and thus had no relevance to Bangladesh.
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And crying about US gynaecology care and unidentified women being starved and bombed is a good look?
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Pat_Bee wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 5:39 pm

And crying about US gynaecology care and unidentified women being starved and bombed is a good look?


Men don't cry.
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What an embarrasment the ICC is. First they rig the seedings for the Super 8s to ensure India goes into the easier group, and then they guarantee them the semifinal without the reserve day. I don't think I've ever seen sporting body so blatantly favour one nation over all others.
My All-time Zimbabwe XI
Neil Johnson, Brendan Taylor, Murray Goodwin, Andy Flower (w), David Houghton, Sean Williams, Heath Streak (c), Andy Blignaut, Paul Strang, Eddo Brandes, Blessing Muzarabani
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Kriterion_BD wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 3:17 pm

For the record, I'd like to see Afghanistan lose to South Africa as well. Because I'm a salty ass Bangladesh fan and they beat my team. 😂

I'm just not going to fake caring about women's rights in Afghanistan but not complain about women not having healthcare access or being massacred elsewhere.


You can care about both of them equally. The issue is that you are making them all the ICCs issue when they are not.
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