2nd T20I | Zimbabwe vs India | July 7, 2024

Ya I can't remotely agree with guys getting run a ball for respectability. That's been ZC's default setting AND more importantly the players themselves.

That's one of the reasons I'm not rating Clive atm. Been his default as well, then everyone, particularly the "selectors" (and I use that term with a curled lip), go back over old scorecards and say he's averaging 25-30 at 110% so he must be good, but the reality is he's bogged the innings.

We have to forget about losing respectably because it's the very reason we have not improved. Look it depends on whether u bat or bowl first. Batting first the openers have to assess and play accordingly. They generally f**k it up and then 3-6 lose wickets as well and then everyone is consolidating at a run a ball and then Burl comes in and is supposed to go at 160 for 3 overs to set something worth bowling at. We're trying to get a respectable 140 to have something to bowl at. This I can understand.

Batting second I'd rather see us all out for 70 chasing 200 than being 120 all out so some dude guarantees he gets picked next game. Use the opportunity to try and play some shots and not pad your average.

You can't drop Myers. Give the dude all 5 games. Give Campbell and Bennett all 5 games.

You can drop Madhevere, Masakadza, Jongwe and Madande all day. They've had plenty opportunity and there's nothing new to see. They're good players, I'm not saying they're not, but unless Salamander has black magic we're seeing a ceiling with these guys. We need a higher ceiling. Or they need to go and reinvent themselves, but not in the national team, give the others a fair crack of the whip.

Just my 10c

Pat_Bee wrote: ↑Mon Jul 08, 2024 12:25 pm

Most sides realise you need to open with your best player too. Old ZimDawg and I frequently say we should open with Raza and nobody wants to hear a bar of it. Wessly contributes a third of the runs on the board yesterday striking at 110 and suddenly out comes the old what other sides are doing argument 😂 😂

Ya, Knackers replacing Kaia seems legit.

Too many people here think with a 50 over mentality and say stuff like ‘kaia is good against the new ball pace’.

Firstly in t20 they often start with spin. They have power plays.

You only have 120 balls. It’s the equivalent of coming in at the 30th over.

You rank your best batsman 1-6 and that’s the order they come in. Maybe tweak that to put the most destructive player up front if he isn’t the best.

Raza needs to open as you want to give him as much width to make a good score.

Even if he opens he probably only faces 60 balls.

If he comes off it’s blitzkrieg.

Otherwise you get Wes run a ball 40’s.

Bennett and Raza must open.

Burl and Naqvi would be more suited to open.

Bennett is doing fine at three and is young. Let him settle.

All of Raza’s success has been at 5. He’s played for about 50 different teams all around the world under some exceptional coaches and not a single one ever has thought he should open, which says a lot. He has been successful in his current position, leave him be. He’s also captaining, bowling, and is our best fielder. Why add opening to his list of duties. We can’t be a 1-man team, someone else has to step up sometimes.

Burl

Naqvi

Bennett

Myers

Raza

Campbell/Marumani

Madande

….Is a T20 lineup I would like to try.

secretzimbo wrote: ↑Mon Jul 08, 2024 5:33 pm

Burl and Naqvi would be more suited to open.

Bennett is doing fine at three and is young. Let him settle.

All of Raza’s success has been at 5. He’s played for about 50 different teams all around the world under some exceptional coaches and not a single one ever has thought he should open, which says a lot. He has been successful in his current position, leave him be. He’s also captaining, bowling, and is our best fielder. Why add opening to his list of duties. We can’t be a 1-man team, someone else has to step up sometimes.

Burl

Naqvi

Bennett

Myers

Raza

Campbell/Marumani

Madande

….Is a T20 lineup I would like to try.

So if Raza comes in at 5 and comes in the 11th over, it makes sense for our best T20 bay to face about 25 balls?

Was Raza the best batter in these other teams?

Why should Naqvi open? He hasn’t earnt that.

ZIMDOGGY wrote: ↑Mon Jul 08, 2024 6:39 pm

Why should Naqvi open? He hasn’t earnt that.

Our middle order is stacked, there really isn’t much of a vacancy. The vacancy is at the top. If he’s as desperate to play for us as his bank statement suggests then he should try at the top.

If I’m throwing anyone to the wolves then it’s him.

mnelson68 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 09, 2024 12:48 am

Googly wrote: ↑Mon Jul 08, 2024 2:43 pm

Ya I can't remotely agree with guys getting run a ball for respectability. That's been ZC's default setting AND more importantly the players themselves.

That's one of the reasons I'm not rating Clive atm. Been his default as well, then everyone, particularly the "selectors" (and I use that term with a curled lip), go back over old scorecards and say he's averaging 25-30 at 110% so he must be good, but the reality is he's bogged the innings.

We have to forget about losing respectably because it's the very reason we have not improved. Look it depends on whether u bat or bowl first. Batting first the openers have to assess and play accordingly. They generally f**k it up and then 3-6 lose wickets as well and then everyone is consolidating at a run a ball and then Burl comes in and is supposed to go at 160 for 3 overs to set something worth bowling at. We're trying to get a respectable 140 to have something to bowl at. This I can understand.

Batting second I'd rather see us all out for 70 chasing 200 than being 120 all out so some dude guarantees he gets picked next game. Use the opportunity to try and play some shots and not pad your average.

You can't drop Myers. Give the dude all 5 games. Give Campbell and Bennett all 5 games.

You can drop Madhevere, Masakadza, Jongwe and Madande all day. They've had plenty opportunity and there's nothing new to see. They're good players, I'm not saying they're not, but unless Salamander has black magic we're seeing a ceiling with these guys. We need a higher ceiling. Or they need to go and reinvent themselves, but not in the national team, give the others a fair crack of the whip.

Just my 10c

Do you think that players play safe rather than with freedom because of the fear of being dropped after a couple of Innings if they don't make runs ?

I think it might be a factor with some players certainly. It implies a serious losing mentality.

Bennett went in there grimly determined to chase that total. Wes was there not showing a lot of intent. Maybe the intent was there but he wasn't seeing the way forward- good deliveries not in his areas.

We don't play enough T20's domestically. I don't know how many times we have to say this. When we do they're back to back to back and it's over in a week. Then most of our internationals are T20- how the f**k are we supposed to compete?

Then the bowling in our T20's is mediocre. You're going to get hit me balls often enough that you don't often need to be inventive or go after a good ball. Now trying to get after a class bowler who gives you very little is extremely difficult for someone not used to it.

They need to identify who could possibly open (say 5 guys), and say to them (I'm talking in our domestic t20) be as attacking as you can. Be sensible but try and hit boundaries.

How else are you going to get openers used to going hard in the power play, without being stupid.

Salamander could of course get 4 or 5 guys that have opening potential and work with them for a couple of weeks and they get quality throwdowns and see who has the ability to hit good balls and say "right these guys we can develop and work with" because our main problem is poor power plays. How often are we 35-40 for 3. Most times. You're losing from there most times.

If he was our right coach he'd say to ZC- line them up I want to see for myself. Or he could rely on Mutendira and Mangongo to feed him information. I think we know the answer 😂

I've been around this game long enough to know that there's only a small handful of guys with the talent to despatch good deliveries. You only gotta hit a couple and even a good bowler will change it up and start to make mistakes.

They just bowl at us with confidence because we can't hit it off the square.

Middle order is full. I know Maru has the shots. He's been unable to take it into an international so far, and maybe he can't, but I think he can be developed into a really attacking front line T20 batter.

He reverts to that pick up pull behind square a lot, it's a go to shot for him, and I think when he's feeling pressure he brings it out instead of looking in front of square more often.

Maru is not a golden boy, they pick him because he dominates at domestic level. Wes is a golden boy, lost some sheen of late with his personal issues, but he has Steve in his corner now. He's not a big hitter and you need them in T20.

Same as Shumba- he likes to nudge it around as well. Not quite an accurate description, they can hit the s**t balls, they struggle to score off tight bowling- ones and twos, but boundaries are limited. Really hard to change that. You are what you are at this level and hard to go up a notch.

So Naqvi has got the ICC Approval now?